mentalgear1 hour ago
The EU is displaying exactly the kind of political leadership we need in this topic: pro-consumer, pro-environment, and firmly against planned obsolescence. Removable batteries were the industry standard in the early days of mobile phones, and it worked perfectly. We only lost that standard when Apple’s 'walled garden' mindset infected the rest of the industry.

The amount of avoidable e-waste generated since then is unfathomable: We are talking about mountain-sized piles of discarded electronics, much of it exported to Africa and Asia. There, people (often children) burn those pieces to extract the remaining rare earths, inhaling toxic fumes in the process, while the remaining hazardous garbage is buried and left to poison the groundwater. It is an absolute moral failure that our society, and politicians beholden to Big Tech lobbyists, let this go on for so long in the name of pure profit for a few big companies at the expense of everything else.

atoav53 minutes ago
This is the role we need governments to take. If you want your government to work like a corporation for some reason, why not go to a country where the govnment is weak and corporations bribe it instead? Would give you some good image how well that works.

But I get it. This ideology has more to do with how much money these types can then extract from a government and if implemented fully you would have some sort of neo-feudalism where everybody needs to pay them to even exist. But that is not a real utopian vision of something that moves humanity forward (quite literally the opposite).

shablulman1 hour ago
The "removability and replaceability" requirement for portable batteries is a massive win for device longevity, but the Battery Passport is arguably the most sophisticated part of this framework.

By creating a standardized digital record for larger batteries, it provides the transparency needed to finally make a secondary market for "second-life" storage (like using old EV batteries for home solar) viable at scale. It’s a great example of how regulatory standards can help solve the information asymmetry that usually prevents circular economies from functioning efficiently. It will be interesting to see how this shifts industrial design priorities over the next few years.

hadrien011 hour ago
Is this comment AI-generated? All recent comments from this account are two paragraphs-long, and are a vague retelling or the article.
bjackman23 minutes ago
I hate constantly discussing this but this one is quite interesting.

"It's a great example of..." definitely set off my slop alarm.

On the other hand it isn't actually "a vague retelling of the article" it's picking out a particular element that the commenter wanted to highlight.

wolvoleo1 hour ago
I hate that kind of thing though when it would come to smaller batteries. This battery passport prevents the user from replacing their car battery themselves easily. Which is entirely in contradiction to this legislation's objective for smaller devices which aims at making self-service easier. But it also links devices to their battery meaning one can not be recycled apart from the other!

It's already causing problems for me there. I often repair small electronic devices, or I remove the battery and repurpose them. For example I use some old tablets and phones with the (often bloated) battery removed, and replaced by a DC-DC converter set to 4 volts or so. This way the device 'thinks' there's a battery. Because most devices with an originally integrated battery will not even power up on USB power if they think the battery is not present or deep discharged. And bloated batteries are unsafe to keep on a charger 24/7 so I remove them.

However the local recycling point is getting increasingly difficult about accepting loose Li-Ion and Li-Po cells. I put them in individual ziplock bags and tape over the contacts but they seem to view them as industrial waste or something. They sent me to the central disposal unit far from the city center but even there they were very hesitant to accept them. And at one point they accused me of running a business because I had 5 different batteries to recycle (I had saved them up because they always give me such a hassle). I think businesses have to pay for recycling or something, I don't know and don't care because I don't run a business.

This in effect stimulates 2 things: People just throwing them in the normal bin which is a waste and can cause fire. Or recycling the whole device instead which is a waste of resources if the original device can still be used.

The battery passport links the device to its battery and only 'approved' facilities can break that link so I think this is a very bad idea for smaller devices when it comes to self-repair people like me. And I will fight that with a passion.

For EVs etc I don't know how that works, I don't use cars nor care about them. But I think even there being able to work on a car at home would be a good thing no?

athrowaway3z1 hour ago
I have no clue what you're trying to say.

The whole point is that people don't throw away their original device.

Yours situation seems rather niche, and it sounds like you might be going out of 'business' while at the same time allowing 1000x times the number of people to want to do dummy-self-repairs (i.e. replace their batteries) even if it's with a bit more theater about who is licensed.

The total number of people means much more demand - even for what you cook-up manually as not-a-business.

mg1 hour ago
I have been maintaining this chart of phones with replaceable batteries available in the USA for 10 years now:

https://www.productchart.com/smartphones/removable_battery

Man, is it empty these days. The chart used to be pretty full. Now it only has about 1% of all phones that are in the Product Chart database. As the other 99% have fixed batteries.

I'm looking forward to see if the EU decision will push some companies to do this for their US versions too and revive the chart.

cyberrock55 minutes ago
The EU directive doesn't even compel them to have those kinds of removable batteries in the EU, because being removable with commercially available tools is considered compliant [0]. The topic has been too obfuscated with hype pieces. Still, it would be nice to not have to break glass and melt glue to open up phones.

[0] https://repair.eu/news/making-batteries-removable-and-replac...

vinc7 minutes ago
I don't see any Fairphone on the page, they are not sold in the US?
throwa3562621 hour ago
If I read this correctly they are concerned about 2 things: harmful substances in batteries and cars with huge batteries that cannot be changed.

Sounds reasonable to me, although I expect the zero-regulation folks to have their usual meltdown about this.

ekjhgkejhgk1 hour ago
Lets see how long it takes this time until someone shows up and calls the EU a nanny state.
pjc501 hour ago
It's 5am in New York, not even the most dedicated anti EU Americans are up yet.
drstewart1 hour ago
As soon as Australians and Canadians who have their governments captured by big interests and don't want to admit it wake up, no doubt
XorNot50 minutes ago
It's 9pm in Australia right now mate, and I have no idea what we're supposed to be doing? Not liking this? Why?
mkj33 minutes ago
No it's not, it's 6pm!
PunchTornado11 minutes ago
Ah this would be too good to be truth. I had my iphone for 6 years and finally had to ditch it this year because of the battery. otherwise the device was good, all i needed. felt so bad that I should discard it just for the battery.
7777777phil1 hour ago
The replaceable battery yes.. but the buried lede imo is the material recovery targets. EU imports basically 100% of its lithium and cobalt (https://rmis.jrc.ec.europa.eu/rmp/Lithium). Mandating high recycling rates for exactly those materials is industrial policy in an environmental costume. Same pattern as their payments regulation (https://philippdubach.com/posts/europes-24-trillion-payment-...), frame sovereignty as consumer protection and nobody fights you on it. Clever, honestly.
danaris46 minutes ago
I mean, it's not really a costume. This is a case where a shrewd industrial policy genuinely goes hand-in-hand with what's best for the environment. Win-win.
cyrusmg2 hours ago
It came up recently in local news. I wonder how they force that for earphones...
padjo38 minutes ago
I have a pair of fairbuds that have user replaceable batteries.
oulipo231 minutes ago
The regulation is mostly meant for light electric vehicles for now
dguest21 minutes ago
Where do you get this from? From what I could see it applied to everything from cars to laptops.
atoav1 hour ago
I am not sure if thst is really a problem. Batteries of hearing aids have been replaceable for a while now.

There appears to be a few reason to become excempt from the rules, e.g. medical reasons (if it is in your body safety is more crucial than removability of the battery). So who knows what Apples lawyers will do with this.

cyrusmg1 hour ago
I never looked into hearing aids - would the interchangeability affect weight ?
relistan1 hour ago
It’s not clear to me from this, but I hope that the “removability” component of this means the end of “disposable” vapes with a fixed lithium battery installed. I can’t even count the number of these I’ve seen littering the roadside. Ideally this raises the cost of that business model enough to also eliminate some vendors from that product category (“disposable” vapes), which is primarily aimed at/used by children anyway.
mentalgear1 hour ago
I agree, disposable vapes are an absolute perversion. I never thought we would come to a point where throw-away "technology" (e.g. microsystems, batteries) would be acceptable like a throw-away cigarette. Absolutely wicked, and again many politicians that have been captured by the vape industry to not act against it.
lozenge53 minutes ago
The UK banned disposable vapes, the suppliers now add a charging port and the ability to put in refills. The refills cost as much or more than the vapes so now people throw away the "reusable" vapes as if they were disposable.
pjc501 hour ago
I would argue that under WEEE disposable vapes were never legal, it's just that nobody cares and EU directives rely on self-enforcement.

Next time you see one, look for the "no bin" symbol)

sylware45 minutes ago
And noscript/basic (x)html for web sites? They broke them to force the usage of whatng cartel web engines (or they were incompetent and/or malicious).

At least on critical sites.

GAFAM and big tech do not like protocols and file formats simple and able to do good enough job that stable in time, because you would not need the software they control.

oulipo246 minutes ago
At https://infinite-battery.com we built just that: a repairable and re-generable battery for e-bikes :)

We even made it compatible with Bosch ebikes!

atoav1 hour ago
As someone who does electronic repairs I welcome this. There are too many devices where the battery is the first point of failure and it is glued in. The number of batteries I could only remove with hot air and heat due to the battery being glued in is too damn high.

Heat for removal works but is always like defusing a inextinguishable bomb and takes much more time than it should. I also have rarely seen a design where the glue was really necessary for the design. Basically they could just have put the battery in without glue and it would have worked just as fine.

Maybe companies really need that kind of regulation to so the common sense right thing.

There are excemptions in cases where it is really technically needed as far as I can tell (medical, water-tightness for safety reasons, data integrity needed so battery can't be removed). I hope they are not too lax with those.

blell1 hour ago
Gluing batteries solved the old issue where you would drop your phone and it would shut down.
omnimus1 hour ago
It's not so much about them being glued in but that nowdays they seem to be glued behind display and al the rest of the phone while there is no access from the back.
lozenge52 minutes ago
How big an issue was that really? Pick it up and put it back together and it turns on again.
mschuster911 hour ago
Adding a tiny strip of glue to the battery so it doesn't slosh around in the case is not a problem.

The problem is that you need heat to open up the device itself (all that is between the battery and the hot air gun is about 1mm of glass), followed by a bath in isopropanol and lots and lots of twaddling around with tweezers and spatulas to get the old glue residue removed from both the display and the case (risking damaging either in the process), followed by really annoying meticulous work to place a new glue sheet exactly onto the case (or display) to make sure it fits again. Oh and you always risk cracking the display while removing it.

atoav49 minutes ago
That is a solved issue and has mainly to do with a badly designed connector and has been resolved since the late 2000s. Glued in batteries don't use any other connector than batteries that are glued in. And if your case isn't designed like shit a drop should not open it.

Try it with a modern Fairphone for example. I had one for years and not a single time the back lid fell off or the battery disconnected. I had a couple of batteries die in phones tho. General point: If you argue with people who have more experience on an issue than you, bring the receipts and red-team your own statement before you make it. Everything else doesn't really shine a good light on you.

IshKebab1 hour ago
Are they going to have an exception for waterproof phones? Seems like it would be challenging to implement replaceable batteries while maintaining waterproofing. Are there any waterproof phones on the market with removable batteries?
VorpalWay2 minutes ago
Why? You can use an o-ring around the seal and screws to press it together. Even simpler: a water bottle like you might bring to the gym or while hiking is water proof, without needing glue. It is a solved problem. But the solution adds tens of eurocents to the cost of the phone, so the manufacturers won't do it unless they are forced to.
LtWorf11 minutes ago
Before they found out they could sell more phones glueing batteries, my waterproof phone had a replaceable battery and a 3.5mm jack.
hdgvhicv55 minutes ago
I Can change the battery on my waterproof watch just fine
jl650 minutes ago
iPhone batteries are already replaceable, albeit most people have to pay Apple to do it. Does this count as replaceable under this mandate, or is there an expectation that batteries must be replaceable by end-consumers on their own? Any requirements for what level of skill and tooling end-consumers are expected to have access to, such as specialized screwdrivers and re-waterproofing adhesives?
dguest24 minutes ago
cutting out quite a bit from section 11:

---

A portable battery shall be ... removable by the end-user ... with the use of commercially available tools, without requiring the use of specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to disassemble the product.

Any ... person that [markets] products incorporating portable batteries shall ensure that those products are accompanied with instructions ...

---

in other words you need to either make it easy and safe with standard tooling or include the tools people need.

Waterproof products are also specifically exempt.

jl64 minutes ago
Thanks. So this is not going to lead to user-replaceable batteries on iPhones.
oulipo232 minutes ago
It's not what they mean, they mean being able to re-generate a battery by replacing their cells, exactly what we're building at https://infinite-battery.com for ebikes